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Saturday Oct 03, 2009

Rosner's Domain: Should Iran be trusted?

Posted by SHMUEL ROSNER
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A lot of Iran-related articles in recent days.

Krauthammer:

Confusing ends and means, the Obama administration strives mightily for shows of allied unity, good feeling and pious concern about Iran's nuclear program -- whereas the real objective is stopping that program. This feel-good posturing is worse than useless, because all the time spent achieving gestures is precious time granted Iran to finish its race to acquire the bomb.

Diehl:

What then? Pollack, a former Clinton administration official, says there is one obvious Plan B: "containment," a policy that got its name during the Cold War. The point would be to limit Iran's ability to produce nuclear weapons or exercise its influence through the region by every means possible short of war -- and to be prepared to sustain the effort over years, maybe decades. It's an option that has been lurking at the back of the debate about Iran for years. "In their heart of hearts I think the Obama administration knows that this is where this is going," Pollack says.

NYT:

We are encouraged that more talks are set for later this month. But this is no time for complacency or wishful thinking. The United States and its partners must push Iran to open all of its declared nuclear facilities and allow inspectors to interview any Iranian scientist they choose to - the only way to figure out what else Iran may be hiding. The leading powers must also be ready to impose tough sanctions if Iran resists or if negotiations go nowhere.

Clawson:

U.S. friends in the region have reason to be suspicious of the Islamic Republic. Iran wants a greater role in the region than its neighbors want it to have, and revolutionary Iran is using force to achieve that aim, whether in Iraq, Afghanistan, Lebanon, or the pursuit of a nuclear program. The United States, as a status quo power, has little interest in helping Iran upset the regional status quo. In short, even if it were possible -- which it is not -- a U.S.-Iran strategic realignment would be undesirable.

 Kaplan:

What steps toward political and economic accommodation the United States and its allies might take in exchange for Iranian steps toward denuclearization - whether this sort of diplomatic back-and-forth is even possible or desirable, given the nature of the Iranian regime, especially in the wake of its fraudulent election and hideous crackdown on protesters - is not clear.

Caryl:

Still, it's safe to assume that some skulduggery has already been taking place out of the public eye. The Israelis (and the Americans) must be keeping a close eye on every Russian cargo airplane that enters Iranian airspace, not to mention ships traveling between the two countries across the Caspian Sea. And given the tensions, it's easy to imagine that Israeli special forces are already hunkered down in the desert outside Natanz and Arak, keeping a close eye on everything that's happening in the surrounding countryside and getting ready to switch on their laser pointers when the time is ripe -- as they apparently did in the run-up to the 2007 raid in Syria. This story is far from over.

 Will:

Gates says "the only way" to prevent a nuclear-capable Iran "is for the Iranian government to decide that their security is diminished by having those weapons, as opposed to strengthened." But to accept that formulation requires accepting two propositions that would tax the White Queen's powers of belief.

One is that possession of nuclear weapons would make Iran less secure. Question: If Saddam Hussein had possessed nuclear weapons in March 2003, would the United States have invaded Iraq? Iran's leaders probably think that they know the answer.

The other proposition is that Iran's regime seeks nuclear weapons merely to enhance the nation's security and not also for regional hegemony or the enjoyment of the enlarged status that comes from being a nuclear power. To believe that, draw a long breath, and shut your eyes.


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1  |  Daran, Saturday Oct 03, 2009
Simple answer is no. However that does not mean Israeli aircraft should take off this evening, none of the articles Mr Rosner provides links to gives an appraisal of the effect of a strike on Israel. I commend readers to an article by Jonathan Rosenblum (this site today) while I don't share his religious sentiments I do think his analysis of outcomes in the event of Israeli strike alone is worthy of consideration. International coalition is required to deal effectively with Iran and outcomes of military option. Should the community fail to confirm Iranian intent without the need for "trust"
2  |  Mike Feldman Canada, Saturday Oct 03, 2009
Before giving my opinion on the header, I'd like to opine on the breaking news that Amadinejad was born into a Jewish family. I believe when they saw the baby, they cried out that G-d had forsaken them and could not imagine what they had done to deserve Mahmoud. In an act of defiance they converted. In terms of trusting Iran, if you accept that Iran is building a facility that is too small for a commercial, peaceful-use nuclear plant, fortified and hidden underground, with multiple entrances and guarded by Iran's elite soldiers to produce electricity then trust them.
3  |  nada ful, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
I trust Iran to try to do what they say they will do...........destroy Israel and kill the Jews.
4  |  lydia, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
2.Israel has been threatening to attack Iran forever, not satisfied with instigating the Georgia war and the Iraq war culminating in the death and incapacitation of millions, the bomb bomb Iran drumbeat was so loud that POTUS dispatched his envoys to Israel to make it emphatically clear that Israel has no authority to attack Iran and would be doing so without US backing. Medvedev and Putin summoned your luminaries to Moscow for a scolding and relayed the same message. Israel started Iran's and South Africa on the road to WMDs, Iran is only playing catch up, you reap what you sow.
5  |  jehtro mayham, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
Rules of Engagement - American style: Kick ass first, take names later.
6  |  David W. Lincoln, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
As long as the ravenous wolves continue to run Persia into the ground, that lot has no credibility to do an about face. They know their Mao too well, especially when it comes to the Cold Eye. So, they need to be replaced by those who pay more than lip service to property rights being defended and/or protected for more people, rather than fewer, and for this to be done more often, rather than fewer. For the track record of the wolves is this: property rights for fewer are protected less often, as opposed to those they demonize as the Dar al Harb.
7  |  Terry - Eilat, Israel, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
You missed what John Bolton said & he didn't beat around the bush like most talking heads & ''experts'' - the bottom line, military action. The only result of Obama's policy is to leave Israel no choice in attempting a military strike. Iran cannot be ''contained'' nor can it be deterred. Sanctions will not work, diplomacy is a dead-end. There is no acceptable level of risk with a nuclear Iran. At this point, we should be ready to use EVERY means available to us to damage Iran's nuclear program even if it only means a delay. And, this should be done NOW.
8  |  Chris USA, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
Should one trust a snake or a scorpion? Should you pet a tarantula? It can be done but is it worth it? Ask the proper question and you define the issue. Nothing less than a regime change or an invasion will suffice. The question is one about resources and capabilities. Is it an acheiveble outcome with the means at hand? What are the alternatives? The answers define the outcome.
9  |  lydia, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
7 Your are as bat sh-t stir crazy as Nugget. Bolton is a l-o-s-e-r and if Israel couldn't beat the puppets i.e. Hamas and Hezbollah what chances does it have taking on the puppet master. We have been messing with the Iranians for decades and behind the removal of their beloved Massadegh. Israel 'secret' WMDs means we can't point fingers at Iran's intransigence. Israel is fast losing US support. and neither China nor Russia is likely to pick up the slack. You have been cleverly played by the Iranians! Perhaps you should engage their PR machine, because theirs leave yours for dust.
10  |  Daran, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
Terry, could you tell the blog what you think some of the outcomes of an Israel alone strike would be. How many Israeli's do you think would be at risk from missiles response from Iran and it's proxies (would any not be!) I note you capitalise "every" means . Does that means you would expect the Iranians to use every means to respond. CW/BW and radiological devices in warheads or "delivered" by cells. How does this effect the numbers of Israeli's killed. Or its that you think Iran would not respond with any means.
11  |  David Maryland, USA, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
Iran can be trusted to make life miserable for Israel and for the West as long as the current regime remains in power. The big question is will they try to gain nuclear weapons that they will use to threaten the Western world and the destruction of Israel? While Ahmedinijad does not control power in Iran, he is nonetheless the mouthpiece for the mullahs and the world saw what happened when the "election" results were challenged as being fraudulent. I believe that sanctions are not going to work and bombing the reactors will only "buy time". The only real answer is regime change soon!
12  |  jonah Viet-Nam, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
Yes,trust a hyena with your baby.
13  |  Terry - Eilat, Israel, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
#10 Daran. What are the consequences of a successful Iranian nuclear attack on Israel? What are the consequences of a nuclear-armed Iran on the activities of Hezbollah & Hamas, protected by an Iranian nuclear umbrella? What are the consequences on the entire Middle-East as countries accomodate themselves to Iranian influence? In other words, the consequences of a nuclear Iran are far worse than the consequences of an Israeli strike. And, how many will die in a nuclear exchange with Iran - how many Iranians will die when we retaliate? This is the real scenario.
14  |  Terry - Eilat, Israel, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
#10 Daran. I've said this before, preemption actually saves lives in the long run. You appeasers, always fearful of action, inevitably create the conditions for even worse consequences. This is what happened before WWII, remember Chamberlain & ''peace in our time''? Your motto is why settle for 10,000 casualties today when you can have 10 million casualties tomorrow. Personally, I think that is the height of irresponsibility, a perverted logic. We will deal with Iran, we will deal with Hezbollah, & if necessary, we will deal with Syria. And we will be better off for it.
15  |  Mike Feldman Canada, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
The alternative to war with Iran, is war with Iran. What I mean by that is that the blockades and restrictions that would have to be placed on Iran to dissuade them, would be essentially a declaration of war. I would think their response would not be substantially different than if their nuclear plants were hit. There is no rose coloured glasses scenerio here. Daran how many Israelis do you think will be killed if Iran develops a nuke and either uses it or passes it on to one of its proxies? I'm not sure if your comments are motivated out a concern for Israeli lives, or'a desire to frighten Israel with the consequences of action.
16  |  REX USA, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
PM Netanyahu's flight to Moscow with the list of Russian scientist working in Iran should show how serious the situation has become. Its the scientist behind the scene who will be responsible for World War III. Russia Putin figures who controls Middle-East oil controls the world, while Ahmadinejad believes the Moslems will control the world. Israel must realize the nations in our world care little for Israel and will be willing to trade Jewish lives for oil. Israel stands alone against Ahmadinejad's madness.
17  |  Daran, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
I reject entirely my motivation is lack of stomach (or that of my gov) to take on Iran or anyone else given enough provocation. I consider the actions of Iran extremely provocative concerning nukes. I have never shirked from the idea that military option might prove necessary. I 'm just sure that such a dire act would require at lot more than Israel alone could muster (unless she used first strike nukes, unthinkable and as evil an option as leaving the mullah with nukes to me). I have constantly called for the same thing in the many posts, international coalition to confront Iran and aftermath
18  |  Terry - Eilat, Israel, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
#15 Mike. How do you think Daran would react if Israel said England should be wiped off the map, if we began shipping missiles & money to the IRA for use against English civilians, if we said that our religion requires us to exterminate all the English or at the very least, expel them from the British Isles. We could put on TV shows teaching children that killing Brits was a mitzva like Hamas does. And all the while, we would have secret military programs to produce missiles capable of reaching England which could carry nuclear warheads? You think he'd preach restraint?
19  |  Daran, UK, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
Further to my above post, my concern is for Israeli lives but its not limited to them,the ordinary Iranian people, who seem to have sold the pup that the west opposes peaceful nuclear tech in Iran, would suffer. The men and women we ask to carry out military operations in our name need considered and a frankly bewildering array of geopolitical and strategic effects. So drastic is the military option I fear we must steel ourselves to a share of the horror war brings.
20  |  Terry - Eilat, Israel, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
#17 Daran. Your problem is that there is NEVER enough provocation for effective action. This game has been going on for more than 8 yrs. - nothing but double-talk, wasting time, & cover-ups by the IAEA. All the while, Iran has been engaged in various terrorist activities. Now time has run out & in the face of irrefutable evidence, the double-talk continues, there are more excuses & rationalizations, & inaction. The conclusion is that the US & others tacitly accept a nuclear armed Iran, regardless of the likely consequences to us.
21  |  Mike Feldman, Canada, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
Daran. Now we're on the same page. "I fear we must steel ourselves to a share of the horror war brings". The problem, I feel, is that the current Iranian regime feels that the horror war brings is their destiny to bring on "The End of Days" and Israel is their target for achieving this goal. Its not possible to counteract irrational thought with rational thought. One way or another and unfortunately confrontation is, in my view, inevitable. Israel is going to do its best to control the circumstances of this conflict. Terry your #18 speaks for itself. I doubt that as a Canadian I could imagine the scenerio if I was not a Jew, and I did not see thr results of weakness, foot dragging and appeasement on a daily basis. Obama and Iran are Israel's perfect storm.
22  |  Terry - Eilat, Israel, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
#19 Daran. ''So drastic is the military option .....'' Those are your words. And a nuclear-armed Iran is not ''drastic''???? A nuclear-armed Iran won't bring ''the horror war brings''??? You are so conditioned against military conflict you can't even see that circumstances warrant such action. People who won't fight for their values, for their freedoms, for their country, will lose it all to those who are far less squeemish than you. And that is EXACTLY what is happening to Europe now. This isn't being civilized, it's decadence & cowardice.
23  |  Terry - Eilat, Israel, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
#19 Daran. What you cannot understand is that there are really evil people in the world, that there are really evil ideologies that motivate them. These people aren't kidding, this isn't just rhetoric. And when faced with such evil, it is our obligation, our duty, to fight them & defeat them utterly. You want to reason with rabid dogs but all you'll get is a fatal bite. Well, pardon me for not sharing in your lack of realism - I'm kind of old-fashioned & still believe in right & wrong, in good & evil.
24  |  Piera Prister, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
The bottom of line is that a Commander in Chief should have a military strategy in the event of imminent catastrophe, other than complacency, diplomacy, talks and playing a waiting time that never worked out. But Obama does not seem to have a stategy of victory. Ispections themselves lead nowhere. Mullahs are too astute to be trusted, like Kim Jong Il who fooled the democratic community by making us believe he dismantled his nukes he fraudulently sent to Tartus in Syria and the glorious Israeli Air Force victoriously bombed.
25  |  Sam K USA, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
How's this for a "SANCTION" on Iran...a 30,000 pound bomb (being developed now) right on Ahmadjihads head! That is when he visits a Nuke site! Terry #22 #23 says it all for me!
26  |  roy S usa, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
There is no quetsion that Israel should only hit Iran nuke sites with USA approval and aid! Israel alone takes on too much of a burden. its bad enough except for the USA ...Israel stands alone! They should be working on that plan now...i hope!
27  |  Joe, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
Now thats its being reported achiminidijad is a Jew and the whole iran nuke scandal is a mossad trick, the question is should israel be trusted?
28  |  Shelley, Australia, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
29  |  Shelley, Australia, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
Trust Iran? HA! No way. Iran has lied continuously, and we all know if Iran gets the bomb they will hit Israel first, American next, and so on. Iran isn't interested in peace, they hate Jews, and the west, and be forewarned, if the west even Russia, England, etc do nothing about this, we are in for a nuclear holocaust, because islamic nations have no regard for life, and they prove it with suicide bombings, terrorism etc. Iran will contstantly lie, they have proved themselves as liars, and I bet they have other facilities where they are trying to make a nuclear bomb. The world needs to wake UP
30  |  Daran,UK, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
that don't you see evil in the loss and suffering of war is beyond me. Which may prove to be a necessary one. My considered opinion is that not only must the nuclear facilties be targeted but the entire missile defense of Iran both air and ballistic Bar the reactor at Busheur (reasons limited by post). More than they must be a attempt to decapitate the head of the command and control including the highest political/religious levels. All republican guard bases assets and units excluding the other elements of the Iranian armed services where possible.
31  |  jerome henen, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
iran will obtain nuclear weapons no matter what we do or do not do. obama can not afford another war and bad timing puts iran where it wants to be with a us president more concerned with maintaining celebrity good guy status than anyl concerns over existence of israel. his naivete' is apparent as indicated by sarkozy. obama has virtually no understanding of the deep enmities in the middle east and thinks that he can unite all in a bear hug of goodwill and camaraderie. this wishful thinking is total anathema to arab thinking who only see weakness in him.
32  |  M.Marshall, Sunday Oct 04, 2009
#5 Rules of Engagement - American style = SNAFU
33  |  Colin Beck, Surrey, B.C., Canada, Monday Oct 05, 2009
SHOULD YOU TRUST A PYROMANIAC WHO PLAYS WITH MATCHES?
34  |  Hofikoman, Monday Oct 05, 2009
30 years after the siezure of the American Embassy in Teheran, those who siezed that embassy are starting to talk nicely to the American government for the first time. They do not want to miss the opporunity Obama is giving them. Expect these Islamic revolutionaries to continue to cultivate a public face of moderation whilst relentlessly pursuing the construction of a nuclear weapon which they will attempt to keep secret. Iranian politics has always been about pursuing "win-win" scenarios for themselves and having their cake and eating it too. Is the democratic West up to the task of scrutiny?
35  |  David, Monday Oct 05, 2009
Terry – If you could promise us that the consequences of an Israeli attack on Iran will be confined to Israel only maybe we would consider it. But since the consequences will have on regional and global ramifications, you better leave Iran to be dealt with the more responsible, sane big boys. Go take a swim and make sure you got a hat on.
36  |  Jonah in Jamaica, Monday Oct 05, 2009
Daran we appreciate your good will and recognition that war is horrible.But Mike Feldman and Terry are unfortunately correct in their assessments. There are evil people. There is Islamic insanity ruling in Iran which sees the destruction of Israel and Jews as the means to some end we cannot rationally understand. Even a failed Israeli attack is better than none if it leads to the world powers realizing the need to prevent a nuclear Iran and actually stopping it.
37  |  A Talebi (Iran), Monday Oct 05, 2009
So much Iranian support for Palestinians when in fact they supported their beloved Saddam Hussein and Iraq against Iran during the Iraq-Iran war in the 1980's when millions of Iranians died. On the other hand, Israel helped Iran by bombing Saddam's nuclear reactor in Osirak, Iraq during the Iraq-Iran war so that Iraq couldn't use nuclear weapons against Iran. Also, Israel was one of the few countries that sold arms to Iran when everyone else was helping and selling arms to Iraq. This is the truth whether other Iranians hear it or not. Iranians should come first in Iran not Palestinians.
38  |  Mike Feldman, Canada, Monday Oct 05, 2009
#37 A Talebi. Sincere thanks for outlining the "logic" that drives the current Iranian leadership #30 Daran. I believe many of the things you have mentioned are correct. I don't think, however, that the game plan will be put out by the Israelis for publice debate. #35. If Hitler would have been happy with only the gift of Poland, a lot of lives could have been saved. But the "sane, big boys" were unable to contain him, and the US Neutrality Act didn't prevent the loss of about 50,000 American troops. If anything can be said in the sane big boys defense it is that they didn't have the luxury of seeing history repeating. The antedote is not waiting for it to happen.
39  |  Tom, US, Monday Oct 05, 2009
I'm listening to Scott Ritter right now regarding what is taking place in Iran. The ONLY function of the IAEA under the NPT is to account for the amount of uranium enriched. Which is completely in compliance with the NPT. Iran has NO nuclear weapons program. I was reading an article earlier today regarding 1000 lawsuits facing members of the Israeli government as well as the IDF for Cast Lead. You have 3 lawyers representing members of your government for 1000 lawsuits. So the question remains, how much more trouble do you want ?
40  |  , Monday Oct 05, 2009
Nuke Tehran before they nuke you.
41  |  David U.S.A., Tuesday Oct 06, 2009
Should Iran be trusted? Oh hell no!
42  |  SY , USA, Thursday Oct 08, 2009
THE IRANIAN REGIME CAN NOT BE TRUSTED. THEY HAVE TO LIE TO ACHIEVE THEIR NUCLEAR GOALS. THEY ARE STALLING AND PLAYING A DANGEROUS GAME. THE REST OF THE MIDDLE EAST WILL NOT TOLERATE THEIR ACTIONS. AT THIS PRESENT MOMENT, IRAN IS THE MAIN PROBLEM IN THE MIDDLE EAST. THEY SEND INSURGENTS INTO IRAQ AND AFGANISTAN AGAINST ALL THE FORCES. THEY INSTIGATE AGAINST ISRAEL USING PROXIES OR PAWNS LIKE HAMAS AND HEZBOLAH. THEIR REGIME IS RADICAL AND ARE VERY DESTRUCTVE IF ANYONE GETS IN THEIR WAY. THEIR QUEST AGAINST THE SUNNIS, WESTERN CULTURE AND ISRAEL WILL NEVER END UNLESS THEIR REGIME IS DESTROYED.
43  |  carlos l miami,fl, Thursday Oct 08, 2009
the iranians should be able to have nuclear weapons like everyone else that wants them.however,when they threatened the destruction of country like israel,or anyone else;then they can expect at minimum israel nuking them out of the middle east.and israel will be justified in doing so.i do not agree with israeli policies,but that is the reality of the current world we live in.the jews cannot afford a second extermination of their people.remember their motto-never again.the iranian regime has demonsrated they do not care for their own people.the ruling mullas are nothing more than dictators .
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Mike Feldman, Canada: lydia. I understand you took a couple of days off to go on de-tox. It obviously didnt work. You're still full of it.
Mike Feldman, Canada: #54 Duncan Lennox. Curious hypothetical for you to quote. In all your previous blogs you denied that the Battle of Jericho per the Book of Joshua ever happened.Now you quote results of attitudes towards the battle. I'm looking forward to your review of the movie "2012, now playing in a theater near you.
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