Monday Sep 24, 2007

Jewlicious: Woke up this morning, got myself a gun...

Posted by ck
Comments: 13
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After going through a series of necessary and understandable but nonetheless very annoying bureaucratic hurdles, I find myself today a gun owner. When I lived in Canada, I never had any interest in gun ownership. I applauded as the Federal government added increasing barriers between those who sought to own firearms and the firearms themselves. I looked at my neighbors to the south and the havoc caused by the right to bear arms enshrined in the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution, and had no envy of their liberal gun ownership laws. Quite the contrary, I was often shocked by the power of the NRA and some of their seemingly insane policies.

This was all, of course, in keeping with my general political disposition which I felt to be decidedly Liberal. I believed in and benefited from socialized healthcare, socialized higher education and a benevolent government that created a social safety net beneath which few if any citizens, no matter how dire their circumstances, ever found themselves. Other Liberal values followed suit - women’s equality, a woman’s right to choose, gay rights, aboriginal rights, religious tolerance, racial equality, environmental protection etc. My family belonged to an Orthodox synagogue and while some of the values espoused by politicians on the left of center did not exactly jibe with our religious values, the perspective that sought to protect the underdog and the disadvantaged resonated far more with us than those values held by politicians on the right side of the political spectrum.

Moving to Israel threw a lot of that into disarray. Here it seems, it doesn’t matter what you believe in terms of domestic policy - ideological orientation is determined solely on the basis of your opinion regarding the Middle East conflict. Thus Benjamin Netanyahu of the Likud party is considered a right winger more for his hawkish defense policies than for his supply side economics. Yossi Beilin is best known for his involvement in the Oslo and Geneva Accords and the Israel-Palestinian Peace process. The fact that domestically he is considered a soft Capitalist did not prevent him from being elected chairman of the left-wing Meretz-Yachad party - he just never discusses his domestic agenda in public.

And then there’s me! True, I am a recent gun owner. And I believe in a strong defense policy in order to maintain the security and viability of the State of Israel. But I still believe in values I held in Canada. I hate Ayn Rand. I hate Social Darwinism. I think trickle down economics is idiotic. I believe that the wealthy ought to share in the social well being of the society that allows them to achieve their wealth, I do not consider taxation a form of theft, I would never vote for a party on the right, I believe in strong gun control laws everywhere, I believe in the equality of all citizens regardless of race and creed, I believe in the separation of Church and State etc. Despite all that, in the eyes of some - my position on the Middle East conflict - my support of the Security Barrier, my refusal to divide Jerusalem, my support of surgical pre-emptive action against suspected terrorists - these things alone make me a right wing loon on par with Kahanists and right wing elements of the Republican party.

So the question is - is it wrong for me to think these people are idiots, badly in need of a refresher course in PoliSci 101? Can one not be a Liberal and still believe in a strong and secure Israel?

This post originally appeared on Jewlicious.com.

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1  |  Bubba, Monday Sep 24, 2007
Yes. You are wrong to think people who disagree with you are idiots. Start with analysis instead of emotion and you might find that some of your other liberal ideas are out of whack. Start with the the "womans right to choose" vs. the "baby's right to live". Who is more vulnerable? Who is in more need of defense? You have your gun.
2  |  ck, Monday Sep 24, 2007
Hey Bubba, I don't know how y'all swing down in Texas but Judaism teaches me that a fetus does not count as a human life or a "baby." An abortion is a horrible and terrible thing to undergo and I would never recommend it - but it's not my body is it?
3  |  Bubba, Monday Sep 24, 2007
I talked with someone who survived one, she wouldn't recommend it either. Got a citation for the "it's not my body" approach? Jonah thought that way at first, but then he changed his mind.
4  |  Dave the Canucki Repub, Monday Sep 24, 2007
Can a liberal support a strong Israel? No. Liberalism (increasly) condemns exclusivist states like Israel, which cannot, and ought not, follow the cosmopolitan, social welfarist model. Your characterization of people to your right as 'loons' betrays your closemindedness. You are just another liberal bigot (with the same sort of snotty, holier than thou Canucki attitude that drove me to the USA) with strong sense of your tribal/religious heritage. These characteristics are increasingly becoming incompatable (as the logic of liberalism unfolds over time, with greater and more pervasive expressionso of relativism and egalitarianism), and like many Jews you will either be forced right by the Left's condemnation/hatred or will abandon Zionism. P.S. You didn't imbibe your love of separation of church and state from Canada as it doesn't exist there. Nor will you find it in Israel.
5  |  pop seal, Tuesday Sep 25, 2007
One can never own too many guns or shoot at a well managed range too often. Guns are fun. I enjoy buying them, shooting them, cleaning them, and most of all....carrying them.
6  |  Joseph, Tuesday Sep 25, 2007
You are a breed that fits perfectly with history in Israel. Militant borderline communists who would have the country be a charity case until the end of time because 'redistribution' undermines the creation of a strong and independent economy. Oh, and an unborn baby does have status in Judaism. It changes as the baby develops. But because it is considered the aggressor if the mother's health is in danger, it loses the which life/limb comes first question. In non-health situations rules on abortions change drastically with time.
7  |  Donald Duck, Tuesday Sep 25, 2007
A liberal is, technically speaking, in the middle. In the middle is a wonderful place to be when there is no conflict, no trouble, no warfare. Generally speaking, I would consider myself a liberal, being pro-choice rather than anti-choice, but in international affairs I do sympathize with the Kahanist affair, as well as multiple right wing tendencies of less notable popular appeal. However it is important to realize that in canada, whilst appearing to be noble and enlightened, no political party will adjust laws to say that killing another is wrong, to the point that they spend more than 2 or 3 years in prison at best. Sometimes the death penalty seems in order, sometimes 100 year sentences would appear in order, but canadian law will remain sluggish and backward for the fore-seeable future. Canada also does not appear to understand that in some countries your fingernails get ripped out as standard investigative practice, particularily useful where unusual knowledge becomes forthcoming. Therefore any support for the canadian flag or its international involvements will remain condition and context based. Canada remains quite the bubble, detached from the rest of the world, and useless in the context of matters as the persian bomb, persian offenses, adventure in darfur/sudan-these are simply thoughts......
8  |  ck, Tuesday Sep 25, 2007
Rashi discussed the case of a man who murdered a pregnant woman. The question was did he commit one murder or two? The fetus was viewed as a potential life and not an actual life. Thus the answer was one murder. Everything flows therefrom.
9  |  Jeff, Tuesday Sep 25, 2007
CK - I was in the same position as you in the USA prior to 9/11. I was a life-long Democrat and liberal on domestic issues, and I still am. However, whenever I believed in a strong US security during wartime, I was mocked and derided by other liberals. We represent a new political classification - strong on national security and liberal on domestic issues. At one time the US Democratic Party had such values. Now I am outsider completely from the Democratic Party, and basically an independent.
10  |  Roland Berger, Tuesday Sep 25, 2007
I am not a liberal.Yes,I believe in all the values that you have listed above- but mostly,I believe in my right to live.History teaches us that nice words and principles do not stop bullets. Other bullets do. This applies to individuals,society,countries. And don't trust your dear Arab neighbours even for a second.Carry you gun,and use it,if necessary. I do,because I also have unfriendly people surrounding me.
11  |  george, Tuesday Sep 25, 2007
"Can one not be a Liberal and still believe in a strong and secure Israel?" It is a semantic question that depends on who is defining "Liberal" and how they define it. But I say yes, we can do both. It's good that you're reminding people that being a knee-jerk anti-Israel rabble rouser isn't a prerequisite for being liberal or leaning leftward. Unfortunately, the far left is trying to convince the moderate left that the two are in fact incompatible. I'm afraid they're succeeding. And to make matters worse, those on the far right don't help much either when they support legitimate self-defense while in the same breath spewing hateful, racist rhetoric.
12  |  paulb, Tuesday Sep 25, 2007
poitical philosophy and labels are luxuries indulged in by people who are not fighting for survival. A common, evil enemy tends to be the great equalizer. Hitler brought us all together, even communists and capitalists. Sometimes we just don't know we are in a war for our survival until the enenmy is kicking down the door. Even a dead neighbor doesn't always get our attention, ala 9.11.
13  |  Efox, Tuesday Sep 25, 2007
You believe in gun control for who? Of course you should have a gun and you should have medical care too. It is good for your health to be able to defend yourself. That is equally true everywhere. Israel is the model conflict on this subject, Israel needs the right to defend itself and Israel's enemies will never abide by any law. When choosing religions, it is best to choose one that agrees with you. Actions speak louder than words. You can not believe in one thing, do another, then claim a religion that supports neither.
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